Today, on a very special Temerity Jane…
August 11th, 2009 | by TJ |Internet,
I want to talk to you about something important today.
Internet safety.
I’m a member of a forum where people have bios, and often, regular posters will chastize new posters for having their full names in their bios. It’s not safe, they say. There are a lot of crazies out there, they say.
I’ve often said, and I’ll say again, that I’m not afraid of the Internet. Are you?
I don’t use my real name here, but I’ve not made a secret of it. Also, even if you don’t know it yet, it would take you mere seconds to find. Once you have my full name, what are you going to do with it? What is a crazy person going to do with it?
I don’t post my address here, but if you’ve been on the Internet long enough, you’ve left enough of a trail that someone, determined, could find you. What do you think would happen if the Internet knew your address? What about your cellphone number? I’ve never had a problem giving out my cellphone number to anyone who has needed it for any reason. What are you going to do, text me to death?
I realize that Internet safety is important. Children should be taught to keep their personal details private. Your financial information should be as secure as possible.
However, what do people think they are protecting by hiding their name?
Let’s set aside work issue – we all know that you shouldn’t say anything on the Internet that you’re not prepared for your boss to see. I’m not talking about job security, I’m talking about actual safety.
You’ve all read the stories about the crazy people I meet. There was the guy in the car at the stoplight. There was the married guy. There was the Coors Tall Can guy. There was the 9:30 Club guy.
These are all people I met IN REAL LIFE. I have met more freaks in trips to 7-11, concerts, even at WORK than I have ever encountered on the Internet.
I’m of course not going to post my address, and I don’t publicly post my cellphone number. But what if I did? What would happen to me? Do you think that an Internet person is any more likely to knock on my door and hurt me than some random thug walking down the street and choosing a house? Are you, an Internet person, more likely to be a psycho because I can’t see your face than the guy who stands too closely behind me at the ATM?
Do you think that if you hide your last name from the Internet, the Internet can’t hurt you? And do you think the Internet is more likely to hurt you than the person you accidentally cut off in traffic? Or the mailman who knows your name, address, handles all your bills and credit card offers and may walk right up to your door every single day?
I think my point is that Internet safety has changed. I mean this in two ways:
One, hiding your name is only giving you a false sense of security.
Two, EVERYONE is on the Internet now. Even if it ever was a refuge for pervs and freaks, that’s now changed. The average person is now on the Internet. The average person is not a perv or a freak.
What kinds of Internet safety precautions do you take? Do you do it out of habit, or do you really feel that what you do makes you safer? What do you think could happen if you dropped these precautions? And when you really think about it now, what do you think about Internet safety, as a whole?
By Tami on Aug 11, 2009
I think avoiding address and phone number is as far as I take it. I make no secret of the city and state I live in (or country, for that matter) and I will happily meet over-the-internet folks at a neutral place (coffee shop) or guildmates I’ve known for years at my actual home. Even my address, I give out regularly for doing swaps and mailing things. Like you said, psychos can find me no matter what I do, and I believe the danger of internet psychos to be less than real life psychos.
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By Arrens on Aug 11, 2009
It has its place, as you mentioned, with regards to financial security & identity theft. However, I have posted my name on my website (it’s on the bottom left of the page, for those curious, be they pervs, freaks or otherwise). Why? No idea, really. But my name is shared by 30 people that work in my company alone. Figuring that large of a number in a company my size, there must be at least 60,000 people in the U.S. that share the same name. I’m not overly concerned about it.
And like you, where I live isn’t anything top secret. Nor is my email (which you undoubtedly see tagged with this comment, TJ), phone number or anything else about me. I’m pretty much an open friggin’ e-book.
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By Kestrel on Aug 11, 2009
The Internet doesn’t scare me. My full name is out there “everywhere.” I recently created a Facebook page with my full name (AND links to family members for crying out loud).
A simple “whois” search on Kestrel’s Aerie will give you all the info you’d ever want. In fact, Phaelia used Whois to find my phone number and call me when she thought she and I might be on the same cruise to the Mexican Riviera a couple years ago. While my wife was a little puzzled until I explained, neither she nor I were the least bit “freaked out.”
Yes, if you’re an impressionable child, or otherwise immature or unworldly, you can “get in trouble” on the Internet. Guess what? The Internet is part of our lives. You can get hit by a car, carjacked, mugged, shot, stabbed, or fall off a boat. Life happens.
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By john the diver on Aug 11, 2009
Why I am stalking you right now!
I think internet safety is the new news panic button, like sars, west nile, and Obama’s obvious kenyan nationality.
I say damn the torpedoes and full speed ahead. Think about your actions and the consequences and you will be OK.
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By Sass on Aug 11, 2009
I am not sure I do anything other than the non public address phone number thing. I’ve got two different domains, both of which are registered to me that a simple whois of would disclose my information anyway. In fact, if you google my name on the webbernets, it will bring up soapturtle and any google of soapturtle would bring up my name, because I’ve held it for several years now.
I guess the only thing I don’t really do is talk about work all that much. Besides the fact that what I do is hard to explain, a small portion of it is Clearance protected, so I just don’t talk about it. But anything else? Fair Game. And I don’t care if an employer does read it. I am a firm believer of free speech, and of having opinions, and fear that someone someday might not hire me because I have a mind of my own is silly.
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By Awlbiste on Aug 11, 2009
My full name is easy to find, my phone number is on my facebook page. My address isn’t publicly known but I’ve given it out before (to an Aussie friend who offered to mail me some Vegemite as a joke).
I’ve spent all my formative years on the internet and I really feel quite safe here, and in my own home in “real life” as well.
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By Awlbiste on Aug 11, 2009
Oh yeah, and if you REALLY wanted to stalk me, you could follow my Twitter and figure out where I work. Actually I’d feel pretty safe about that too since we have a panic button and the neighborhood always has a cop or two walking/biking around.
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By Jason R. Peters on Aug 11, 2009
1. Hide my full name? Forget it. I have branding to do. I have to make inane comments and hope people think they’re smart so that when I finally break into publication, they’ll remember me. Too many people share my first name AND my last AND both (one is even an English professor).
2. Never could find a screenname I liked anyway. I use characters from my books, but those are obscure enough that I sometimes get asked, “What the heck is a _____?” And of course, if I’m eventually successful, those names will no more distinguish me than you would now be distinguishing yourself by using Drizzt, Gandalf, Garrion, Tyrion Lannister, or Vin.
3. I take the “needle in a haystack” approach to paranoia. Okay, so google can save — AND SEARCH — my email. But there are literally billions of emails. Unless I have reason for them to seek me out, I’m a drop in a bucket.
I apply the same logic to cell phone calls, credit card usage, and so forth.
I know people who WILL NOT use a credit card over the internet for fear of it being taken. I’ve been doing it for years, and so far I’ve only had one series of false charges — all fully refunded with no fuss.
The ironic truth is that if the same person shops at a grocery store or department store with the credit card, the information is GOING OVER THE INTERNET ANYWAY. Furthermore, there are devices that will let people in the parket lot scan you and get information from your driver’s license or credit card.
If someone wants to steal from you, they will steal from you. It’s like the Seinfeld bit about hiding the wallet in the toe of the shoe. The criminal would NEVER think to look there! No, really, you haven’t outsmarted them with little tricks and cautions like that.
A cell phone conversation might not be secure. Guess what? Your land line can be tapped too.
I think the right level of caution is “don’t be stupid.” Don’t hand total strangers your credit card, or give it your address.
I’ve posted my phone number on the internet before (to a guild) and I don’t think it ever rang…at all. That was to a group of friends.
There are scary stalkers out there, but teh Interwebs is not out to GET YOU if you post personal information.
TJ is dead on.
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By Tuna on Aug 11, 2009
I’ve never really tried to hide any information about myself. To be honest, people on the scary interwebs probably know more about me then some of my own relatives.
Just from my site, you know my name, where I live, what stuff I watch, what music I listen to, what games I play, and when I play them.
I’ve had people message me on my MSN even though I don’t know how they got it, but now I talk to them regularly online.
You are correct. The interwebs is nothing to be afraid of.
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By Syl on Aug 11, 2009
I most wholly agree with TJ here. Yeah, the ‘net has its feaky weirdos. I’ve encountered more freaky weirdos irl (and gotten some unwelcome attention, too) than I have online.
If you’re hanging out on the unsavory parts of the ‘net, yeah, maybe posting your personal info isn’t brilliant. If you’re in the majority, though, just puttering along on blogs, WoW, cnn.com…I don’t see it being any riskier than giving your name and phone number to someone you met at a party.
If you Google my name, the first 7 hits (and a good number of later ones) are me. I’m involved in a lot of stuff, IRL and online, that makes its way into Google. Am I worried someone’s gonna use that to hunt me down and stab me in the face? Not really.
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By Taze on Aug 11, 2009
To me, internet security should be viewed in exactly the same way as the steps you take to protect yourself from people in “real life”. There is no reason to worry that someone out there on the internet knows your name. Most likely, even if they are a creep, they will not take the time necessary to seek you out (millions of people use the internet– you’re not at all likely to catch the eye of some creep), unless you give them a reason to.
However, some people, especially teenagers, have a false sense of security, as if “no one knows you on the internet”, which is also not true. Would they show suggestive pictures of themselves to someone they had just met? What about the infamous bikini pictures? Probably not. So why do they do it on facebook? They are making themselves more than one of the millions who use the internet, and giving the creeps a reason to give them more than a passing thought. The creeps still might not come to their house, but would you really want people you might not even know to see those photos?
Basically, just think before you post. People such as potential employers can look at your internet activities. And 5 years later, you may regret posting some of the things you did. However, I don’t worry about people on the internet. After all, creeps you meet in “real life” can do far more harm than ones on the internet. Be careful, but don’t be paranoid.
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By Elleiras on Aug 11, 2009
I fully intend on posting a RL(tm) screen shot of my new license plates on my WoW blog when they finally come in. :D I’m so not worried about Internet creeps using them to track me down in real life. (Especially since it’s fifty million degrees out right now. Nerf summer.)
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By Kestrel on Aug 11, 2009
Taze makes a good point that shouldn’t be overlooked in all this:
Myth: No one knows you on the Internet.
Truth: EVERYONE who uses the Internet knows EVERYTHING you’ve ever posted (or they could, with very, very little effort). Keep that in mind and you’ll be fine. But Internet anonymity only goes so far. (And it isn’t all that far.)
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By Canth on Aug 11, 2009
My internet safety is in email. Each website I sign up for gets a unique email address. I own my own domain name (my last name.com), so if I sign up for something like amazon to buy stuff, the email address they get is amazon@vdm.com.
That way if I get spammed at a certain address, (ie, they sold my email), I can forward that email address back to them and they can deal with it.
SPAM safety.
(my amazon email is still spam free BTW. but others aren’t. Some sites are so notorious I just use “junkmail@vdm.com” as email, and that one goes straight into the bin)
(I do get funny looks when I tell people my email address over the phone. They often tell me “companyname@vdm.com is our email address, I need to know what yours is”)
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By Jesse on Aug 11, 2009
My only worry is my job and stalkers in the bushes outside my house, but since I’ve never posted my employer and at most posted my city on the internet it’s not that much of a worry. I even have my full name registered as a website, although all it is now is a redirect: http://www.jesseljones.com/
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By Carrie on Aug 11, 2009
Ha. I have just used my ACTUAL real first name and linked it back to my blog. I am that not scared of the internet.
Seriously though, I agree that anyone who is really determined to get to know where you are and what you’re doing is going to do so, regardless of how “safe” you are about your internet usage. You could not even personally USE the internet, other people are doing it for you, and therefore you are findable. I take comfort in the fact that nobody out there gives a damn who I am or where I am or whatever. There are millions of people in the world, most of them have more than me, and are that much more likely to get targeted.
My brother… here’s paranoia for you. I have a blog, obviously, and he started one for his daughter. So I put him in my sidebar, mostly so I could remember where the link was and visit it from time to time. Well, other people use my sidebar as well, and a couple of my blog friends left comments on his daughter’s blog. I got an angry email that I needed to take the link off ASAP because he was certain some pedophile was going to find her blog through the link on mine and do nasty things to his daughter. Because he lives in a big city and of course there aren’t any that might live near where she goes to day care or something. They’re all on the internet, searching blogs for their next victim. MUHAHAHA. And of course I’m pretty weird, so it’s only natural they’d find my blog first, right?
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By Luckedout on Aug 11, 2009
I usually avoid putting personal information. They say to google your name and see what people can find, but having a very common name, especially for my area keeps me off of google. I actually get more links and whatnot back to my user name Luckedout to actual stuff I’ve posted/said on the internet.
You’re right. If someone really wanted to find you, it would not be hard. I keep my kids off the internet but otherwise I don’t really hide. What’s the point?
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By Silent on Aug 11, 2009
Once again, I must take offense, being average doesn’t mean you can’t be a perv or a freak. How dare you say we aren’t pervs and freaks, that hurts our feelings very much :P
seriously though, I think you should take the basic steps to keep yourself secure on the net, no full name, no contact info everyone can see. Keep your bank and credit card account #s and passwords different than everything else and you should be fine. If the hackers want to get in and work at it long enough (nothin is foolproof), then they will. I really think its the people that haven’t grown up with the inter-tubes that are most at risk, they don’t see the traps, tricks and make the mistakes that lead them to problems. We grew up with it, so we are familiar and much moar comfortable.
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By caroline on Aug 11, 2009
My brother was all up in arms because they were putting GPS in all cell phones, and you couldn’t even get a new one without it and the GOVERNMENT WOULD KNOW WHERE YOU ARE OH GOD!
I said, I don’t doubt that they can track me, I just doubt that they are.
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By Liz on Aug 11, 2009
The thing I used most these days are facebook. I don’t put much personal info there anyway, and I defeintely do not post photos my kids on FB. Even on flickr, all my kids photos are set to private.
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By BlueTiger on Aug 12, 2009
I mod a forum where it happens that people post up CVs with full name, phonenumber and adress – we usually remove them, and ask the poster to edit it to remove phonenumber and adress. Your post TJ, made me think though, like you said, if you are a Internet-er, then that information is probably already out there.
Guess it’s just habit – IRL and on Internet, phonenumber and adresses can ofcourse be found, I just don’t give it out freely anywhere.
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By Mahon on Aug 12, 2009
Well, for me what you call “internet safety measures” are more “internet don’t-make-it-easy-to-annoy-me measures”. For example everyone knows that disclosing email in a non-protected way can lead to your address being picked up by an automated software and fed into a spam machine… Same thing but worse for my phone number, I don’t want to be called at 3 am by any lunatic, nor do I want it disclosed to those annoying people who text you / call you to try and sell you automatic garage doors…
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By Starburn on Aug 12, 2009
My concern is more the ‘my boss looking at it’ thing. I’ve got a fairly unusual name – i’ve only found one person with the same name via google, and they’ve only got as far as facebook, so pretty much everything returned by google is me.
Which is fine as it is work-safe, but equally I don’t want potential interviewers to know and prejudge based on my various interests as shown on message-boards etc e.g. the mmorpg kneejerk reaction
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By Luckedout on Aug 12, 2009
I have to admit. I just gave out my cell phone to other officers in my WoW guild and that made me feel a little weird. These are people I’ve known for a while and I’m not worried… but still….
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By JEC on Aug 12, 2009
Let me flip the question around on you. What do you get out of being open with your name, cell number, whatever? We can all post here or on other internet venues with our real names, but seeing Richard Smith next to a post doesn’t mean more to me than seeing ToiletDuck77. And for pretty much the same reason you don’t care about people knowing your name–we don’t know Richard Smith _or_ TD77 and it’s unlikely we even want to use that information for anything. If someone does want it, they can always just ask and you can always just give it to them.
Here’s my take on internet security:
I think there’s three levels of it.
1) Actual security — hard to get and simple to lose, although I do think it’s possible.
2) False security — what most people have to settle for, and is why embarrassing photos get out, or why some people get fired for complaining about their boss on Facebook.
3) Making it easy — putting it all out there.
I mean, yeah. Sufficiently knowledgeable people can probably find you if you give them a reason, no matter how careful you are. And you probably have more to fear from someone who lives in your neighborhood. I just don’t see much of a reason to make it easy, that’s all. Taller blades of grass get cut first and all that.
So do I think a cautious approach to identity on the internet buys me anything? Well, probably not…I absolutely agree with that aspect of your argument. Especially since I don’t really do things that would make me a target in the first place. Still, I’m content to let others stick their necks out–there’s probably nothing to gain from hiding my details, but I don’t think I’m likely to gain anything from being open either.
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By Monstro on Aug 13, 2009
There’s a fine line between being open on the internet and being an attention whore on the internet. It doesn’t help that new tools to become the latter seem to come out every day.
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By Aboo on Aug 13, 2009
There is no privacy anymore. If you have an email address, you can be found and your identity can be hi-jacked. It’s just a matter of who would really want to? There are billions of people on the inter-web. Most of them are more interesting than me, so I’m not worried. :)
That said, I hate spam and will go to great lengths to prevent it. I’m more afraid of spam than of psychos.
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By Anonymous on Aug 25, 2009
real name leads to real adresses theres lots of things a determined hacker can do. Send fake calls to the police and have yer house raided by swat for instance or spam you with physical bulk mail. And thats just griefing, I didnt even touch the impersonalistion issues yet.
Personal Information is called Personal for a reason. Should it be made public just because some comunication platform like facebook / myspace hypes it up?
People got fired over twitter / facebook posts if they had been more discreet about their exploits they would most likely still have had their jobs.
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