I draw my evil from your niceness.
December 8th, 2009 | by TJ |I have a confession, Internet, one that a lot of people might object to, but you can’t actually onject because it’s a confession, and you’re supposed to listen to it and nod sympathetically, because I am sharing here, people.
So, here it is: Basically, I do not believe in nice people.
I shall give you a moment to think about that and get all outraged about how you’re a nice person and how dare I, before I continue and explain, just so you get it out of your system. If you like to ocmment the second you find something to be outraged about, without reading the rest of the post for explanation, here would be a good place to stop reading. The link to comment is at the top of the post.
Anyway, as I said, I don’t believe in nice people. It’s not that I don’t believe that people are nice. I just don’t believe in people who are so nice, so nice as a general rule, that the only way you can characterize them when you think about them is as “a nice person.”
Here’s why I think that. Over the years, I’ve come to realize what most people do when they grow up and realize that they are not currently, nor will they ever be a rock star: Aside from a few outlying points here and there I am, in all things, quite average. I mean, I’m pretty standard issue. You know, like if I do something, or I think something, the fact that it entered my head is pretty much a guarantee that hundreds, thousands or millions of people do the same thing, or have had the same thought, or feel the same way.
Now, considering myself to be your standard issue person, it goes along with that to assume that I have standard issue niceness, and all the things that go along with niceness.
And Internet, I don’t know if you know this, but I’m not, like, 100% nice. I am nice, but I am certainly not composed largely of niceness. But I am the average person, in most respects, so I assume that I’m just as nice as the next person. That would me that someone less nice than me is unusual, and someone more nice that me is just as unusual.
That’s science, you can’t argue with that part. Or it’s math. Regardless. Science/numbers don’t lie. Well-established science doesn’t lie, at least. Jenny McCarthy is buying her science at some kind of discount, knock off science shop. I advise you don’t shop there if you want non-lying science. You can rely on my science in this post because I would never shop anywhere that Jenny McCarthy shops. But if you’re ever in the market for science that suits your very specific, nonsensical agenda, science based on things like “gut feelings” and “just knowing,” you should get the address of that science shop from her.
Anyway, whenever I have disagreed with someone on Twitter, or had a slightly-less-than-nice thought about something I’ve read on the Internet (liars, dog killers, etc, etc), I have, without fail, had 6 billion (NUMBERS DON’T LIE) people pop up with DMs, IMs, emails or comments saying “exactly!” So, from that I have learned that if I have a sliiightly less than 100% kind thought, it is not completely unique to me.
However, on the Internet, we all seem to have made some kind of silent agreement to pretend to be way nicer than we actually are.
Don’t get me wrong here, Internet – I am not saying that if you don’t voice every unkind thought that comes into your head, you’re only pretending to be nice. I certainly don’t. Part of average niceness is keeping unkind thoughts on the inside.
In fact, I’m not talking about voicing meanness as a measure of niceness – I’m talking about the complete opposite. It is when people continually voice how nice they are that I stop believing in nice people.
You know, the people who always, always say things like “If you don’t like it, don’t read it!” or, “Oh, is there Internet drama going on? I wouldn’t know, because I’m totally above stuff like that,” or “Actually, I think every single person on the Internet is fantastic and perfect and correct in every single way, so we shouldn’t disagree. Ever.”
When I read stuff like that, I immediately feel like I must be a terrible, terrible mean person. Because I read stuff I don’t like – sometimes I read it just so I can laugh at the ridiculousness of the author. And I follow Internet drama if it crosses my path and seems interesting because it is interesting. And I disagree with a lot of things people say on the Internet, and sometimes I say so. And I don’t think every blog is a good blog. And I don’t think all opinions are valid, Jenny McCarthy. So I must be mean and terrible. Because the nice people don’t disagree and don’t follow drama and are morally superior to the kind of television I like to watch.
But, as we established above, with non-lying numbers and science, I am pretty averagely nice. If I think or do or believe something, I am not so arrogant as to believe I am unique or original in those opinions and thoughts.
So, in a world where I am average (because this is my blog, we are rotating this world around me), and I do not regularly go out of my way to be mean and evil, and am just as nice as the next person, then I simply cannot believe in what passes as the “nice people” when you are using Internet denizens as your sample pool.
However, let me explain further. It’s not because I refuse to acknowledge the existence of nice people that I cannot believe in nice people. That’s not it at all. It’s actually for the protection of nice people.
I knew this girl in college, and she actually was as nice as I described. Not the bullshit nice that most of us try to pull off (which I propose is actually just most people trying to live up to an inflated standard of what they think niceness is, in which it is shameful to admit you’ve ever had an unkind thought, which, come on now, baloney). This girl was actually that nice. You could look at her and truly imagine that she’d never thought an unkind thing about anyone.
ANYONE.
She wasn’t naive or stupid or anything like that, anything that might explain why she was so unfailingly, and I mean unfailingly nice. She was just that nice.
And my reaction to her? On the inside? I struggled with unbearable urges to run up and push her over. Completely out of nowhere. For no good reason that I can explain. The urge just overcame me whenever I saw her. Smiling at me.
So, before you read this post, get all self-righteous and huffy about how mean I am and how nice you are, and get ready to leave a comment about how truly, genuinely, never-thought-a-mean-thing-ever nice you are, just remember that if you do that, and you and I run across each other in public some day, I make no promises that I will be able to contain my urges and I may well push you over.
I don’t believe in you, nice people (I say, addressing you like you actually exist), for your own safety.
By TJ on Dec 8, 2009
Throughout this entire post I’ve used the phrase “nice people” in a way that suggests that if you don’t fall into that particular definition of niceness, you’re not actually a nice person. In reality, I pretty much refuse to require myself to live up to the above described ridiculous standards to consider myself a nice person. As the numbers and science, which don’t lie, have shown, I am average, so I am average nice. Therefore, even though I think mean things sometimes, I still consider me to be a nice person. You are probably average nice, too. In case you were going to get upset about that. I think most people are average nice. Even if sometimes you think mean things or watch Hoarders on A&E or read internet drama ’cause it’s hiLARious. You still count as nice. Just FYI.
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By Vronak on Dec 8, 2009
Maybe nice people should act mean just to protect themselves?
Pushing them over would be called, well, not cow tipping, but… what?
And happy belated birthday TJ.
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TJ Reply:
December 8th, 2009 at 2:06 pm
The point I was trying to make is that what is described as “nice people” in the post pretty much isn’t realistic, to the point where it’s unlikely to even really exist as often as people would like to think. You don’t have to be the kind of nice that makes people want to push you over to be considered nice.
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By Jen_Ann_W on Dec 8, 2009
I feel the same way actually, except that girl you describe at the end? The perpetually kind, sweet, smiling person that you LOVE and, at the same time, want to push them into a mud puddle just to see if they’ll curse and take a swing at you? She’s my best friend. So it’s weird.
What about “normal” people? I totally don’t believe a “normal” person exists in the world at ALL.
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TJ Reply:
December 8th, 2009 at 2:05 pm
I didn’t want to push her over to see if she’d swing at me. I actually don’t know why I wanted to push her over. I just felt like I needed to push her over!
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Jen_Ann_W Reply:
December 8th, 2009 at 2:59 pm
LOL
I’m just an instigator.
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By Fyurae on Dec 8, 2009
Its like those surveys they do where 90% of consumers say they’re sick of hearing about Britney, or they’re sick of hearing about Brangelina, or they’re sick of hearing about other celebrity gossip. Yet I bet right now Tiger Woods is the #1 search query.
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TJ Reply:
December 8th, 2009 at 2:58 pm
EXACTLY. Oh man. EXACTLY.
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By Tchann on Dec 8, 2009
A good friend of mine is a really, really nice guy. Seriously. Nobody can say otherwise about him. He’s nice to everyone, and just a fantastically good person all around.
Unfortunately, this amazing ability of his means that girls are drawn to him because he’s nice…and then leave him because he’s too nice. He just can’t win, sadly. :(
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By Chaninn on Dec 8, 2009
Sometimes, the “nice factor” is the person’s way to rationalize the shit-storm that’s going on around her/him.
I got labeled “nice” for a while during college when I was dealing with a ton of crap in my family and home life, but mainly because I was treating my friends with kid gloves instead of driving them away with the horror and depression that was my reality.
…then I got better! (and a bunch of niceness went poof!)
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TJ Reply:
December 8th, 2009 at 2:50 pm
My point is, though, that even with the “poof,” you likely still count as a nice person. Comparing against the overly nice gives a false impression of what standard niceness really is. You don’t need to be all sunshine, puppies and rainbows all the time in order to consider yourself a nice person.
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By Garrett on Dec 8, 2009
I think this parallels the whole the-media-calls-me-fat-even-though-i’m-not…thing. am i actually fat? sure, compared to Anorexic Barbie, i’m fat…but i’m not actually fat.
in the same way, i’m not actually very nice compared to Perfectly Nice Barbie…but i’m still fairly nice.
I think that people who think super-nice is somehow universally better than average nice are the ones who post stupid things like you described. once a person realizes that being average nice is okay–that they don’t have to be super-nice–that’s when they’ll stop posting things like “arguments shouldn’t be allowed on the internet, thats not what it’s for.”
disclaimer: just because someone else’s standard is too high doesn’t mean you can drop your own standard and be an obese asshole and expect everyone to be cool with it. :D
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TJ Reply:
December 8th, 2009 at 4:39 pm
Aw, crap, that is pretty much exactly what I was trying to say. In 1100+ words. And still didn’t get it as right as this comment did.
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By Awlbiste on Dec 8, 2009
I consider myself a generally polite person but not exactly a *nice* person. I mean, like you, I am probably average nice, but I would never categorize myself as “nice”.
I also love to make fun of stupid people, celebrities to who behave badly, and the jerks on Hoarders. Part of my joy is laughing at my and others’ fails.
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Adlib Reply:
December 8th, 2009 at 4:22 pm
You beat me to it, but I was wondering if “polite” was a better word for what most of us are, instead of “nice”. I was nice in high school, but I was pretty naive of how awful and mean a place the world sometimes is so now that my spirit has been thoroughly broken, I’m not that nice any more. Polite, but not always nice.
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Erin Reply:
December 9th, 2009 at 11:59 am
I was going to say this same thing. Other words instead of “nice” might be professional, courteous, or polite (as you said). And what exactly IS nice? Is it that you generally like everyone, truly, in your heart? Is it that you give off the appearance of liking everyone? Is it that you’re always polite? “Nice” is such a vague word and people tend to use it either as a boring compliment (“She’s so nice!”) or as an opposite word, to describe someone you don’t like very much (“She’s not very nice”).
For me, I tend to not like most people, but instead of being “not nice,” I prefer to cultivate words about myself like professional, quiet, shy, or polite, in terms of how I approach and interact with people. I’m not rude to people, I’m just not overly nice to them.
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TJ Reply:
December 8th, 2009 at 4:38 pm
As long as you laugh at your own fails as heartily as you laugh at the fails of others, I’m going to have to declare you average nice.
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By Julie on Dec 8, 2009
I am not nice. I am probably less than average nice. Michael, however, is truly nice, to a fault sometimes, and you didn’t push him over when you met him . :)
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TJ Reply:
December 8th, 2009 at 4:37 pm
That doesn’t mean I didn’t WANT to.
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By Erin on Dec 8, 2009
I find this all the time in the work world, where I was nearly fired for not being “nice enough” to my coworkers (despite being extremely good at my job), by which I mean I failed to validate their many mistakes, attend the myriad work-social functions (despite the fact that I spend more time with them than my husband during the week), and the fact that I really, honestly, true-to-God DO NOT CARE about your child’s holiday pagent/Halloween costume/eating habits.
My personal philosophy is “nice” is what you call someone when you don’t have anything interesting to say about them, as in, they are so dull/boring/annoying that the most pleasant thing you can call them is “nice.”
Sorry, it’s an issue near and dear to my heart today.
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TJ Reply:
December 8th, 2009 at 4:54 pm
You’re totally about to start me on a somewhat related rant about the current generation of young people who need praise and applause for every single thing they do, even if the don’t do it correctly. Please see the Schmophies post for more on this subject in order to keep me from BLOWING MY TOP ALL OVER AGAIN because in your situation, I would LOSE MY MIND.
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Erin Reply:
December 8th, 2009 at 5:00 pm
I’m preparing to write a post entitled “Work is NOT your Social Life,” based upon a similar premise. It’s not just young kids today – my own boss wanted praise for successfully scheduling her own meeting today (only took the two of us combined nearly an hour).
As for the losing one’s mind, I’m very, very close. Is it so wrong to want to sit in my cubicle, do my work, and go home without needing to hear about everyone’s weekend?
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TJ Reply:
December 8th, 2009 at 5:02 pm
I’ve lived in an extreme version of that nightmare, where the boss tried to hire friends – not hire her friends, but hire people to BE her friends. She wanted to live in a world where her entire staff was her best friends, but were also expected to deal with her unreasonable tantrums, lying, screaming, abuse, name-calling, etc, because she was the boss. I hope your situation isn’t that extreme!
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Erin Reply:
December 9th, 2009 at 12:06 pm
Sadly, I’m about in that nightmare – hence my harping on it in a pseudo-related thread. My boss values “nice” above all other work qualities, including performance. While I am all for developing work friendships, I feel pressured to do so with my boss because it has come up in a “performance” review before, that I don’t do enough “social networking” around the office. Considering my job is 99% logistics, that seems a bit odd to me. I’m polite, I’m courteous, and I’m professional, I just tend to excuse myself when Boss wants to talk about her kids or how Twilight is an AMAZING book. You’re my boss, not my friend, and while the two CAN coexist, they shouldn’t be required to. Then again, the fact that I can’t stand the woman certainly doesn’t help.
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Adlib Reply:
December 9th, 2009 at 1:59 pm
This thread reminds me…my boss calls me by a nickname almost everybody else (friends, coworkers, etc.) uses for me, but with him, it feels weird and not okay because…he’s my boss! He’s not my friend. I just have no idea how I would go about saying “yeah, everyone can call me that except you” essentially.
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TJ Reply:
December 9th, 2009 at 2:14 pm
I have that problem with people being friendly with me and calling me “Kel.” There’s no nice way to say “Don’t do that” without sounding like a total asshole.
By Persequi on Dec 8, 2009
This post is proof that you used to live in the metropolitan DC area. I’m always getting pushed off the cliff around here.
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TJ Reply:
December 8th, 2009 at 4:55 pm
I’m not a mean person, though. I’m average nice.
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By Persequi on Dec 8, 2009
Oh, I did not mean to say that you were a mean person. What I meant is the general attitude towards nice people is common around here. As you pointed out, that does not constitute you being a mean person but more towards the general attitude in this area towards those who are nice here. At least they don’t stay that way for long. Resistance is futile!!!
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TJ Reply:
December 8th, 2009 at 5:26 pm
But you are still making the point that you belong in the group of Nice People and those others of us from the DC area hold an attitude towards “Nice People,” indicating that we are not a part of the group of “Nice People.”
And I disagree with you. I am saying that the average person IS NICE, including those in DC who you feel are not nice ENOUGH for your tastes. Just because there was a ridiculously excessively nice outlier of a person in my past does not make ME not nice. It makes HER unusual in her extreme niceness.
I don’t have an attitude towards those who are nice in the DC area because I AM nice. I AM a nice person. Averagely nice.
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By Roast on Dec 8, 2009
I’m not a nice person, and I agree with you. I’m actually a pretty huge dick that occasionally does really nice things for people that I know or that I think deserve it.
If you pushed me over upon seeing me in person, I’d probably deserve it. It would still be weird though.
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By persequi on Dec 8, 2009
I see where the confusion lies. In my statement, I grouped people into nice or not nice. Now I understand your post. You are correct and I understand now. Thanks for the clarification in your reply.
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By Iain on Dec 8, 2009
I think all of my friends are nice. I think I’m nice. I think some other people are mean.
In my group of friends I have meat-eaters and vegetarians. Some use drugs and some don’t. Some belong to a culture where women are not allowed to certain activities or places due it being tapu and others believe that we are equal in every respect. Some bitch about other friends behind their back and others never have a mean thing to say. Some have committed crimes, and others claim to not even have stolen lollies when they were 7.
Some of these friends think that some of my other friends aren’t nice, but I think that they are. Niceness, I think, is a subjective thing. And the qualities that decide whether someone is nice or not, and to what degree, are also subjective. A person’s culture, experiences, and societal values decide these qualities, and they’ll be different… if not for every personal then at least for every social group.
I guess I may have gone onto a tangent, but the point of this reply is that I agree with you that there is not some realistic goal to be super nice to everyone because that would mean treating everyone uniformly. But I also think it goes deeper than being “average nice”. Because you may be average for your culture but in a different one you’d probably be highly unusual. Therefore I think that there are nearly as many types of “average nice” as there outliers.
But yeah… 100% pure Nice is a myth, I think.
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By Swistle on Dec 9, 2009
I’ve known two girls who I would describe as nice all the way through—like, where I could say I don’t think they even knew HOW to have a mean thought about someone. And both of them were dumb as sheep. Nice, but truly dumb and clueless and oblivious.
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Swistle Reply:
December 9th, 2009 at 10:31 am
And, uh. Also kind of boring.
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By TheWicked on Dec 9, 2009
I definitely would not categorize myself as a “nice” person, probably not even as an “average nice” person.
How nice I am to a person is directly correlated to how much of an idiot that person is. The more idiocy they display the meaner I get.
There are, of course, two exceptions to this rule.
1. The Wife. I have to be nice to her all the time, even if she is being kind of an idiot at the time.
2. Customers while I’m at work.
I seem to have a very low tolerance for idiocy.
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By Stephanie on Dec 9, 2009
I used to get the “You’re so nice.” crap when I was younger because I thought I should be. On the inside, though evil thoughts abounded. As I got older I decided to be myself more and some people were shocked at the sarcasm that is now my normal mode of expression. But meh. I’m nice enough! And I would classify myself as avarage nice still.
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By Al_Pal on May 22, 2010
I’m probably a leetle bit nicer than average, but there’s definitely a trap of thinking people ‘are nice’. (& I wouldn’t want that to be the first thing someone said about me!)
Once a friend asked what a mutual friend’s husband was like–I’d met & spent a bit of time with him, once. I said, IDK, he seems like a nice guy–I mean, he’s Canadian…turned out he was a physical abuser, had broken her arms in the past & shizz. They’re divorced, now, thank god…but geez. People are certainly not always what they seem!
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